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Should I even continue Dragon Ball Super knowing that this will eventually happen?
What an absolute disappointment Ultra Instinct and Ultra Ego turned out to be. These are absolute FRAUD transformations. Turns out both hakai and godlike dodging are USELESS. I thought these forms would completely change Dragon Ball when I first learned about them. For Ultra ego form and hakai technique, I thought it could destroy anyone or anything. However Beerus apparently can't destroy immortals, and potentially not beings like Grand Priest or Zeno. Okay, so being able to one shot anyone that isn't Zeno or the Grand Priest is still cool, right? Except that's not how it works. Apparently it works only on people around or below the users power level. That sounds kinda familiar. It's almost like... uhh yeah, it's like literally EVERY ki based technique we saw but WORSE. Krillin's destructo discs were implied to be strong enough to one shot Nappa in Saiyan Saga. Roshi's Kamehameha was narratively implied to be strong enough to kill Oozaru Kid Goku, so a being that is about 10x his power level. Krillin was literally strong enough to decapitate Frieza with the destructo disc if he combo'd it with his solar flare in Frieza Saga. Both Goku's Kamehameha and Vegeta's Final Flash were strong enough take down Perfect Cell if they were given a clean shot. So what's even the point of Hakai? Seriously? It can only one shot beings around your level of power. Meanwhile techniques we were introduced to in OG Dragon Ball can kill people that are orders of magnitude stronger than you. And what about Ultra Instinct? I thought it was SOO cool when I first saw it. Angel-style fighting, makes you untouchable, puts the fight on autopilot, very good hax ability. I thought the verse would have to come up with some weird biological niche, a cool and previously unseen technique, or something like that to always get around this bulletproof ability. I thought Dragon Ball would be classified as BGT and AGT. Before and after godly techniques. Techniques you have to find very specific counters to get around, like maybe mass-cloning yourself, energy drain, hyper-regeneration, some weird time manipulation, etc. And what did we received instead? Who was the character that made these two forms look like absolute jokes and how did he got around these powers? Well, it was Frieza. As for how did he do it, he did like a few pushups for 10 years in a time chamber. That's it. No new ability, no introduction of a new massive alien race that will be a massive threat because of their anatomy's unique powers, no nothing. Just one villain we've seen before doing the same asspull he did in Resurrection F. At this point, why even bother? How is this any fun? Didn't Whis said one time that regular training wouldn't get Goku on Beerus' level or am I remembering wrong? If he did, how exactly does regular training got Frieza the ability to get around these techniques? Ultra Instinct should give you the ability to dodge, always. Maybe with the exception of an attack from the likes of Grand Priest, Zeno, or maybe even Beerus. But Frieza? A mortal that just trained for 10 years? Such a disappointment. I'm thinking of legitimately dropping Super after I learned about Black Frieza and how lazily these new forms were handled. Instead of changing the story to a specific tone, Frieza just comes to cancel it out. I know it's a long rant but I hate this so much. submitted by /u/Classic-Work-8415 to r/Dragonballsuper [link] [comments]
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reddit.com |
Classic-Work-8415 |
Feb 13, 2026 |
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Favorite changes in the Dragon Ball Super Manga
This all the moments and changes that were made in the Dragon Ball Super Manga that I think were better in comparison to the anime. These either felt like improvements to the scene, writing or characters. All of these are listed in chronological order and the images are meant to match up with the list. 1)Goku uses Super Saiyan God (Red) against Hit: in the anime, Goku continued using Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan (Blue) and then multiplied his power with the Kaioken. While I don't dislike that, I much prefer the manga approach since it acknowledges an aspect of battle that is usually ignored by many DB fans, Stamina and Energy conservation. I also like it because it makes Hit's capabilities more grounded since he comes off more as a warrior who has more refined techniques and skill, not power. That means there's more of interest for Goku to fight smarter instead of harder. 2)Future Trunks becoming and apprentice to Shin and his fight against Dabura and Babidi is explored: in the anime, it was just a breif flashback to how Trunks defeated Dabura and that was it. In the manga, it was more in depth, showing how Shin and Kabito trained him in how to weild the Z-Sword, how the Z-Sword was turned to stone and then destroyed by Dabura (killing Old Kai before he could be released), Dabura killing Kabito and injuring Shin so Babidi could fatally harm him, and then Trunks unlocking SS2 and defeating his enemies. This depiction not only forshadows and elborates upcoming plot points, but it was so good, it was used as the baseline for the final act of the DBZ Kakarot Future Trunks DLC. 3)Goku Black abuses Saiyan's Zenkai Boost to help him better control Goku's body: In the anime, Goku Black is just strong and can go Super Saiyan Rosé. In the manga, Goku Black is at a disadvantage in his first fight against Vegeta till Future Zamasu reveals himself and uses his apprentice Kai abilities to heal his ally. From that point, Goku Black reveals that he purposefully let Trunks live and have little victories here and there so that he can continue refine his new body. This feels more of an apt reason for why Goku Black didn't bother to just kill Trunks from the get go and matches up better with the established rules of body snatching from when Ginyu couldn't fully use Goku's powers in DBZ. Zamasu isn't Goku, so he shouldn't have the same mental fortitude that would allow him to hone Goku's body. Sure he is technically better and smarter than Ginyu, but if that's really all the excuse needed, we are acknowledging his false claims of godhood when really, he's just a narcisist. 4)Future Trunks stalls Goku Black and Zamasu using technique rather than obtaining a new transformation: in the Anime, Future Trunks unlocks a random new power dubbed Super Saiyan Rage or Anger or whatever. There is no explanation of what it is, no real forshadowing to it, so it just feels random that he just leaped to the heights of matching with the level of Goku Black, who is above SSB Goku and Vegeta current level. In the manga, Trunks stalls his enemies with Solar Flare and then with Mai's help, mislead them so Goku and Vegeta can escape. I much prefer this since it shows that Trunks has more abilies than just his father's moves, make a normie like Mai more active in the conflict, and is showing that there other aspects that can be useful than just power, power, and power (sometimes speed too). 5)Gowasu tries to reasons with Goku Black: In the anime, Gowasu is just told about the evil his apprentice has committed and condems him before letting Goku and Vegeta deal with the entire conflict. In the manga, Gowasu and Supreme Kai show up in the future timeline before Goku and Vegeta's final fight and Gowasu tries to reason with Goku Black. This is of course is a vain attempt, but it does do a better job painting Gowasu in a more sympathetic light and shows how he feels responsible that his apprentice is a genocidal maniac. This improves Gowasu character a bit more for me and I feel that the cold approach in the anime just ends up validating Zamsu's "god" complex. 6)Vegeta interchanges between SSR and SSB against Golu Black: in the anime Vegeta overpowers Goku Black in their next fight because he is "turning his anger into power." In the manga, Vegeta uses SSR to conserve his stamina and energy and briefly changes to SSB to deal devastating blows. I prefer this since it shows that Vegeta, on top of being a strong warrior, is a strategic genius since he found a way to counteract the faults of just using SSB. I feel like acknowlegment of any warrior in the series playing smart has started to become rare, especially for Vegeta. The last time it happened for him was when he attempted to lure Dr Gero in following the defeat of Android 19, but that's about it. 7)Trunks is revealed that because he became Supreme Kai's apprentice, he has healing powers: In the anime, Trunks relies of Super Saiyan Rage and thats about it. In the manga, Trunks becomes more of a crucial support once he finds out that he has healing abilities due to being taken on as Shin's apprentice. I never liked SSRage to begin with, so my bias is for the manga, even if it means Trunks isn't directly involved in the fighting as much. 8)Goku achieves perfected Super Saiyan Blue: In the anime, SSB just never really changes outside of enhancements like with Kaioken. In the manga, to help fully counteract the excess energy loss with using SSB while unleashing the full extent of the transformation, Goku achieves a method to maintain that excess energy for him to use. I like this because it's an homage to how Goku and Gohan achieved the same feat with their base Super Saiyan forms back in the Cell saga and makes sense with how transformation throughout the series works. 9)Zamasu never gets a grotesque form: in the anime, because of the fusion with the mortal Goku Black and immortal Future Zamasu, the fusion causes the Fused Zamasu to break down developed a mashapened purple sludgy half. In the manga, no form degredation happens to Fuse Zamasu and he still looks fine. Plus for the brief moment of the battle, he fights shirtless which DB fans admittedly do lose their sh*t over. 10)Future Trunks attacks Fused Zamasu when his Fusion time limit ends: in the anime, Fused Zamasu stays the same and Future Trunks tries to kill him by using a Spirit Bomb Sword attack. In the manga, because both Zamasu's are not truly gods since neither one ever got promoted to Supreme Kai, their potara fusion only has a 1 hr time limit like with any mortal. As they begin to defuse with Future Zamasu's immortal qualities trying to keep them together, Future Trunks sneaks up and swiftly slices them so they split and then stabs Goku Black. I will say that the anime version feels more Shounen coded, but the manga feels more intuned with Future Trunk's go for the kill attitude. Plus the panel comes off more as badass. 11)Fused Zamasu creates an army of himself: in the anime, Zamasu comes back as a giant cloud monster or is the universe or something. In the manga, Fused Zamasu regerates from the bodies of Goku Black and Future Zamasu and self replicates. Both version honestly makes no real sense, but I can say the manga is at least an homage to the Meta Cooler movie, which is (pun intender) cooler. The next few point are going to be about the Universal Survival Saga. I do want to say that the anime interpretation of the arc is the more prefered version compared to the manga, mainly because its meant to be a Battle Royal style tournament. With 50+ episodes, this allowed for more battles and highlights from all participating universes. In the manga, pretty much the only characters who matter were those from Universe 6, 7, 11, and sometimes 2, while all the other universes involved could just suck it. 12)Top's personality is much more calmer and reasonable: in the anime, he is over essentric, hot-blooded, poses a lot, and yells Justice in almost every statement. In the manga, he has a more toned down personality, is very level-headed, and doesn't have an innate disdain for Goku. The anime made Top's character very grating and annoying to deal with so I ended up disliking him greatly compared to the manga version. Don't get me wrong, I like the Ginyu Force in DBZ, but they never felt like they overstayed their welcome and overdid it with their shenanigans. Top in the anime sadly did the opposite for me. 13)Android 17 is equivalent to Super Saiyan 3: in the anime, Goku had to go SSB in his spar with Android 17. In the manga, Goku only needed to go SS3 and it seems Android 17 is only equal to that. I don't care much for power scaling, but I do agree that if too many characters are able to hit the level of the gods, it becomes less significant. SS3 is still within the realm of believability for Android 17 to achieve, especially since we know that he has the help of the Cell Jrs to reach those heights. 14)Kale has been repressing her inate power: in the anime, Kale is a shy and reserved girl who isn't confident in fighting. Once she starts to show more power, she eventually reaches the height of Super Saiyan and a berserk form that is equivalent to a Legendary Super Saiyan like Broly(Z). In the manga, Kale is fully aware of her powers and is repressing it out of her devotion and respect to her leader Caulifa. When she does unleash it, her power is explosive, uncontrollable and she is indeed a Legendary Super Saiyan. While I don't mind the meek Kale in the anime, I much prefer the feel of her personality and character in the manga and how her potential is hinted at throughout while she tries to conceil it for Caulifa. Her reasoning is also reminiscent of Future Trunks not wanting to unveil his Super Saiyan Grade 3 so as to not hurt his father's pride during the first conflict against Perfect Cell. 15)Cabba sacrifices himself to put the potara earing on Kale during her Legedary Super Saiyan state: in the anime, Cabba is eliminated from the tournament by Frieza and Kale and Caulifa fuse to fight Goku. In the manga, while Kale is uncontrollable as a Legendary Super Saiyan, she begins to get overwhelmed by the collective efforts of the Pride Troopers. To save her from elimination and reign in on her powers, Cabba eliminates himself so he can put the potara earing on Kale so she can fuse with Caulifa and become Kefla. The reason why I dislike the anime interpretationis because Kale kept bouncing back and forth from being in control to being out of control and it felt annoying. The manga approach felt more streamlined and put an importance on keeping Kale in the tournament because she ended up being a useful wildcard for Universe 6. 16)Gohan fights and Kefla: in the anime, Kefla primarily fights Goku and is eliminated by him when he unlocks Ultra Instinct Sign while Gohan is eliminated in a fight with Dyspo. In the manga, Gohan fights Kefla and they double ring out. The anime version was good mainly because it led to the cool Goku energy surfing Kamehameha. The manga version I think does a better job with highlighting both characters positive attributes. The anime version of Kefla was overly brash and basically drunk off her own power. The manga, Kefla is still cocky, but in a more good kind of way. Gohan also gets to showcase more of an attitude that people actually liked from him when he became Ultimate Gohan back in the Buu Saga. The overall diaglogue in the manga also displays an air of respect between Gohan and Kefla, which I greatly appreciate. 17)Roshi uses an imperfect version of Ultra Instinct against Jiren: in the anime, Roshi eliminates himself after over exhaustion throughout the multiple fights and multiple usages of the Evil Containment Wave and Goku unlocks Ultra Instict for the first time after surviving his own Spirit Bomb. In the manga, after Goku contemplates that he needed more power to fight Jiren, Roshi steps in as a means to teach Goku that there was more than just power and engages Jiren where he dodges a few attacks before getting knocked out of the ring. Fans have criticized this moment since they think its impossible for Roshi to fight Jiren... even though all he really did was just dodge a few hits before being elminated on top of the rules of the tournament being no killing so Jiren is definitely not going 100% against a 100 year old man. I don't care much about powerscaling, so this doesn't effect me. What I like about the manga version is the story and how it drives the student teacher relationship between Roshi and Goku. Roshi hasn't really taught Goku much since the end of OG Dragon Ball, so this is a call back to that where the former student learns a final important lesson from his old master and it guides him to his ultimate power. 18)Jiren motivation, philosophy, and personality is explored: in the anime, Jiren is extremely stoic character with a might makes right and power is absolute mindset. In the anime, on top of that, he displays more heroic traits like not wanting to leave Universe 11 for the tournament and not liking death and killing (which also contributes to the Roshi thing), and is motivated to use the Super Dragon Balls to revive his fallen master for his approval. The manga gave Jiren more depth and layers to his characters which makes him more appealing while, beyong being all powerful and having the voice of Mortal Kombat's Scorpion in the dub, feels rather boring and on the verge of one dimensional due to his intense stoicism. 19)Vegeta meditates and Goku is surprised at him for doing it: in the movie, Goku is surprised, but in the sense that he doesn't see the benefit in meditation. This kind of flies in the face of all the time he does or see his friends actually meditating. In the manga, Goku is surprise at Vegeta for meditating, mainly because he doesn't see Vegeta as the type to do it, which feels more on brand. 20)Teen Trunks and Goten as Saiyaman X1 and X2 team up with Gamma 1 and 2: in the movie, Goten and Trunks show up for the fight with Cell Max, do a failed fusion...and thats about it. In the manga, Goten and Trunks have an establish superhero alter and they play more of an active role (along with Krillin and 18) in fighting Cell Max and even work alongside the Gamma's in a cheesy but fun superhero esque team up. Admittedly this has more depth since Trunks and Goten had a brief highschool superhero arc prior to this (similar to Gohan Great Saiyanman arc that most people didn't like but I kind of do), so that is pretty much why this feels like an improvement. What other changes did the manga do that you approved of over the anime? Did these changes improve the character or narrative? Please share or even comment on the ones I listed. submitted by /u/PointPrimary5886 to r/Dragonballsuper [link] [comments]
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reddit.com |
PointPrimary5886 |
Sep 20, 2025 |